Where did the green cabbage go?

[lloyd]

Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?

And where did it disappear?

[Sacha]

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

[David in Normandy]

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

I grew some curly kale for the first time this year. That is quite
tasty. I think green cabbages are tastier than white ones anyway. The
darker the leaf the stronger the flavour - in my opinion.

[lloyd]

On Sat, 31 Oct 2009 18:47:25 +0100, David in Normandy

Post by David in Normandy

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

I grew some curly kale for the first time this year. That is quite
tasty. I think green cabbages are tastier than white ones anyway. The
darker the leaf the stronger the flavour - in my opinion.

I wonder if that's fact, and if so why have they done away with it at
the supermarket? Can't even get frozen cabbage now!

[K]

Post by lloyd
On Sat, 31 Oct 2009 18:47:25 +0100, David in Normandy

Post by David in Normandy

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

I grew some curly kale for the first time this year. That is quite
tasty. I think green cabbages are tastier than white ones anyway. The
darker the leaf the stronger the flavour - in my opinion.

I wonder if that's fact, and if so why have they done away with it at
the supermarket? Can't even get frozen cabbage now!

You need to change your supermarket

[Janet Baraclough]

Post by lloyd
On Sat, 31 Oct 2009 18:47:25 +0100, David in Normandy

Post by David in Normandy

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

I grew some curly kale for the first time this year. That is quite
tasty. I think green cabbages are tastier than white ones anyway. The
darker the leaf the stronger the flavour - in my opinion.

I wonder if that's fact, and if so why have they done away with it at
the supermarket?

I think you need to find a new supermarket.

Janet

[RogerT]

Post by David in Normandy

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

I grew some curly kale for the first time this year. That is quite
tasty. I think green cabbages are tastier than white ones anyway. The
darker the leaf the stronger the flavour - in my opinion.

Curly Kale tastes much better after the frosts have been at it!

[lloyd]

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

That's another one. The savoy cabbage used to be such a tasty, classy
cabbage (separate from the green cabbage)..these days it looks and
feels dried out and tasteless that I stopped buying it ten years ago.
I still remember when I discovered it though, gosh it was lovely.

[Gopher]

Post by Sacha

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

Can't you find Savoy cabbage?

Or Kilaton? Pricey seeds but excellent results!

[Graham Harrison]

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

I don't know about cabbage but a couple of years ago I moved from East
Bershire to South Somerset. That meant going from being 10 minutes walk
from Sainsbury, Tesco and Waitrose to the nearest supermarket being
Morrisons a 5 mile drive (well, maybe one bus a day but timed for school so
makes for a long stay for a quick shop) away. Anyway, result is I now shop
in the local village and it's the meat that gets me. Pork, in particular,
actually tastes of pork. So my advice is not to change your supermarket so
much as change from a supermarket to an independent greengrocer, or a
farmers market or something of that ilk.

[Pam Moore]

On Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:35:12 -0000, "Graham Harrison"

Post by Graham Harrison

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

I don't know about cabbage but a couple of years ago I moved from East
Bershire to South Somerset. That meant going from being 10 minutes walk
from Sainsbury, Tesco and Waitrose to the nearest supermarket being
Morrisons a 5 mile drive (well, maybe one bus a day but timed for school so
makes for a long stay for a quick shop) away. Anyway, result is I now shop
in the local village and it's the meat that gets me. Pork, in particular,
actually tastes of pork. So my advice is not to change your supermarket so
much as change from a supermarket to an independent greengrocer, or a
farmers market or something of that ilk.

Or if you live in an area where veggie-boxes are delivered, try those.
Graham, you should be in the area covered by Riverford. Their veg are
wonderful, but a small box costs more per week than I pay for my
allotment for a year. £8 for allotment, £8.95 for a small box of veg.
Lloyd, look for a proper greengrocer as others have suggested. They
do still exist and we need to support them.
The fresher and greener the cabbage the more vitamins you get from
them.

Pam in Bristol

[v***@dinky.vm.bytemark.co.uk]

Post by Pam Moore
Lloyd, look for a proper greengrocer as others have suggested. They
do still exist and we need to support them.

We had one for about 6 months, after I spent years grumbling to my mum
that the only fruit+veg options nearby were Somerfield or Co-op. Then
it closed cos people dropped off using it.
(My 3 year old still complains and wants to "go and see the fruit man"
on the way home every Mon + Weds!)

[lloyd]

Post by v***@dinky.vm.bytemark.co.uk

Post by Pam Moore
Lloyd, look for a proper greengrocer as others have suggested. They
do still exist and we need to support them.

We had one for about 6 months, after I spent years grumbling to my mum
that the only fruit+veg options nearby were Somerfield or Co-op. Then
it closed cos people dropped off using it.
(My 3 year old still complains and wants to "go and see the fruit man"
on the way home every Mon + Weds!)

Your 're right it's not just as simple as getting the greengrocer back
in the local shops, because people just don't use them now. We had one
locally who opened up in an old bookies shop, same story six months
and he was gone. Mind you it was only a halfhearted shop in that it
did not have much of a range.

The supermarkets have done a very good job brainwashing the masses.
You don't get that in France. Mind you I don't ever recall a French
greengrocers! Butcher, baker, candlestick maker, but not a
greengrocer, though they always have markets and they are full of
fruit and veg stalls. Do the French have greengrocers?

Been a while.

[David in Normandy]

Post by lloyd
Do the French have greengrocers?

Yes, but the primary French outlets are the supermarkets and market
stalls. Supermarket veg tends to be relatively poor quality compared to
market stalls, being old and limp. Supermarkets seem to only have one
weekly delivery. Fruit and veg on market stalls tends to be fresh picked.

Prices can vary enormously everywhere. Take red peppers. Depending on
which supermarket you shop in or even on market stalls in the same
market they can vary at the moment between 2 Euro's a kilo and 4 Euro's
a kilo. Double the price!

Best of all is grow your own of course.

[lloyd]

On Mon, 02 Nov 2009 10:56:51 +0100, David in Normandy

Post by David in Normandy

Post by lloyd
Do the French have greengrocers?

Yes, but the primary French outlets are the supermarkets and market
stalls. Supermarket veg tends to be relatively poor quality compared to
market stalls, being old and limp.

You or the veg?

Post by David in Normandy
Supermarkets seem to only have one
weekly delivery. Fruit and veg on market stalls tends to be fresh picked.
Prices can vary enormously everywhere. Take red peppers. Depending on
which supermarket you shop in or even on market stalls in the same
market they can vary at the moment between 2 Euro's a kilo and 4 Euro's
a kilo. Double the price!

That's a strange one then, how we developed the greengrocer and the
french never. I wonder why! Maybe it's because the French do actually
grow much of their own, or they used to?

Post by David in Normandy
Best of all is grow your own of course.

That's a job in itself, can't do both. I'd last about a week on my own
produce.

[v***@dinky.vm.bytemark.co.uk]

Post by lloyd
Your 're right it's not just as simple as getting the greengrocer back
in the local shops, because people just don't use them now. We had one
locally who opened up in an old bookies shop, same story six months
and he was gone. Mind you it was only a halfhearted shop in that it
did not have much of a range.

I think that was also the problem here. He got some good stuff in, but
the lad running it didn't really know his products. He'd never seen a
gooseberry before! And also their storage wasn't great, so things
didn't have as long a shelf life as you might expect. And then he
wasn't exactly priced massively competitively, either. He charged 'per
item' on fruit, and most of it was the same price as we pay in the
canteen at work. (40p/apple/pear/plum, etc seemed about average)

[john royce]

Post by Pam Moore
On Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:35:12 -0000, "Graham Harrison"

Post by Graham Harrison

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

I don't know about cabbage but a couple of years ago I moved from East
Bershire to South Somerset. That meant going from being 10 minutes walk
from Sainsbury, Tesco and Waitrose to the nearest supermarket being
Morrisons a 5 mile drive (well, maybe one bus a day but timed for school so
makes for a long stay for a quick shop) away. Anyway, result is I now shop
in the local village and it's the meat that gets me. Pork, in particular,
actually tastes of pork. So my advice is not to change your supermarket so
much as change from a supermarket to an independent greengrocer, or a
farmers market or something of that ilk.

Or if you live in an area where veggie-boxes are delivered, try those.
Graham, you should be in the area covered by Riverford. Their veg are
wonderful, but a small box costs more per week than I pay for my
allotment for a year. £8 for allotment, £8.95 for a small box of veg.
Lloyd, look for a proper greengrocer as others have suggested. They
do still exist and we need to support them.
The fresher and greener the cabbage the more vitamins you get from
them.
Pam in Bristol

Its so easy to make the mistake of slipping into the habit of doing all
your shopping at one supermarket. we only recently discovered that a small
local shop is selling excellent veg like tomatoes and courgettes at half the
price of Tesco's ! I need to wake up !

[Sacha]

On 2009-10-31 20:35:12 +0000, "Graham Harrison"

Post by Graham Harrison

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

I don't know about cabbage but a couple of years ago I moved from East
Bershire to South Somerset. That meant going from being 10 minutes
walk from Sainsbury, Tesco and Waitrose to the nearest supermarket
being Morrisons a 5 mile drive (well, maybe one bus a day but timed for
school so makes for a long stay for a quick shop) away. Anyway,
result is I now shop in the local village and it's the meat that gets
me. Pork, in particular, actually tastes of pork. So my advice is
not to change your supermarket so much as change from a supermarket to
an independent greengrocer, or a farmers market or something of that
ilk.

That's how we shop here and it's a world of difference to supermarket
stuff. We have one member of the staff who's famous for her road kill.
If she sees that a tractor & trailer has dropped leeks or cabbages or
potatoes, or whatever, on the road, she stops her car, hops out and
picks them up. Then she brings them here and distributes them. You
can't get a lot fresher than that - and free!

[lloyd]

On Sat, 31 Oct 2009 20:35:12 -0000, "Graham Harrison"

Post by Graham Harrison

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

I don't know about cabbage but a couple of years ago I moved from East
Bershire to South Somerset. That meant going from being 10 minutes walk
from Sainsbury, Tesco and Waitrose to the nearest supermarket being
Morrisons a 5 mile drive (well, maybe one bus a day but timed for school so
makes for a long stay for a quick shop) away. Anyway, result is I now shop
in the local village and it's the meat that gets me. Pork, in particular,
actually tastes of pork. So my advice is not to change your supermarket so
much as change from a supermarket to an independent greengrocer, or a
farmers market or something of that ilk.

We do have a local market shop along the main road some way from us
which I have been to a few times, He's the sort of character that puts
all the nice stuff on top of the display and the dodgy stuff in your
bag. Though much of it looks fairly ropey anyway.Maybe I was biased
anyway to the nice clean supermarkets, who do have set standards for
our own safety etc and their brainwashing worked! I'll give him
another go with an open mind.

The person who said about picking up the tractor roadkill made me
laugh lol we had lots of that here at harvest and I decided not to
pick any of the veg up in case it was a crop experiment that was not
fit for human consumption or something. Now where on earth did that
come from! lol

Thanks for all your advice guys on this thread. I might just grow a
couple too, though I do hate fighting with the creatures just waiting
for *another* one to come along every minute.

[v***@dinky.vm.bytemark.co.uk]

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?

I grew white cabbages this year and they are absolutely lovely - very
sweet, although possibly a slightly delicate taste for those who prefer
their leafy greens a bit darker?

[Bob Hobden]

"lloyd" wrote ...

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?
And where did it disappear?

It hasn't from all supermarkets, and certainly not from allotments.
We have Savoys and Winter Tundra cabbages on the plot atm together with two
varieties of Sprout to extend the season and also some Caulis which should
head up about April. The summer cabbages tend to be sweeter and less strong
tasting that the winter stuff but if you want a nice taste grow some Cavolo
Nero kale, wonderful flavour and the plants look so good they would grace a
flower border.

[vsop]

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?

I agree, dark green greens have much more flavor. IMO white cabbage is only
good for coleslaw and shredded in salads. Can't stand that yucky taste and
sulphurous smell of white cabbage. Alas, my wife loves it so guess what I'm
usually served?
My very favorite green is Brussels tops, closely followed by turnip tops
(difficult to source here though) and another winner for me is braised
celery hearts, my Xmas dinner must have .......is that classed as a green?

vsop

[n***@cam.ac.uk]

Post by vsop

Post by lloyd
Is it just me or is the white, tasteless, sanitised lump of nothing
they call cabbage in the supermarkets these days really that bad, or
was the green much tastier and better for us?

I agree, dark green greens have much more flavor. IMO white cabbage is only
good for coleslaw and shredded in salads. Can't stand that yucky taste and
sulphurous smell of white cabbage. Alas, my wife loves it so guess what I'm
usually served?

Nah. Sauerkraut mit wuerstchen.

Otherwise, I agree.


Regards,
Nick Maclaren.