Discussion:
Blanket Weed
(too old to reply)
Another John
2011-02-09 15:10:50 UTC
Permalink
Yes - a popular topic. :-( I realise that this is a FAQ, but technology
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.

I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.

I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.
It's almost *im*possible: traces of the weed remain no matter how hard
I scrub.

I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work? I'm always afraid that it might
do for other things as well as the blanket weed. The one that I did try
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.

I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly" :-(

Cheers
John
Chris Hogg
2011-02-09 17:02:13 UTC
Permalink
Post by Another John
Yes - a popular topic. :-( I realise that this is a FAQ, but technology
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.
I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.
I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.
It's almost *im*possible: traces of the weed remain no matter how hard
I scrub.
I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work? I'm always afraid that it might
do for other things as well as the blanket weed. The one that I did try
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.
I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly" :-(
Cheers
John
Blanket weed is just one of many algae that can invade a pond. You'll
never get rid of it; spores are everywhere in the air, and even a new
pond, starting pristine clean, will get it. But all these algae are a
form of plant life, and as such thrive on the same nutrients as the
plants elsewhere in your garden, and in particular, on nitrogen and
sunlight (if the latter can be considered a nutrient). Nitrogen in
ponds usually comes directly or indirectly from the food people give
to their fish, either from the crap that the fish excrete or from the
decomposition of uneaten food. It can also come from fertiliser either
washed in from surrounding soil, or deliberately added in the form of
pellets to feed the plants in the pond, or from the soil they're
planted in.

To minimise blanket weed, don't feed the fish. I have fish in my pond;
I never feed them and they survive quite happily. Cut down on the
fertiliser you give to the plants, and only use poor quality soil for
planting them in, preferably sub-soil or clay soil low in humus, or
the soil you can buy in garden centres especially intended for ponds,
but not ordinary garden soil. Also make sure you have plenty of plants
in the pond to take up any free nitrogen that does occur in the water,
including water lilies. The lilies will also shade the pond surface
with their big leaves, cutting down the light getting into the water
below, and further reducing the blanket weed. Some types of algae are
not a problem in the pond. I'm thinking of the fairly short stuff that
covers the sides and other surfaces, and which I've seen described as
'woolly jumper' algae. This too will help mop up any spare nitrogen so
should be encouraged.
--
Chris

Gardening in West Cornwall overlooking the sea.
Mild, but very exposed to salt gales

E-mail: christopher[dot]hogg[at]virgin[dot]net
Bob Hobden
2011-02-09 18:09:18 UTC
Permalink
"Another John" wrote ...

Yes - a popular topic. :-( I realise that this is a FAQ, but technology
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.

I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.

I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.
It's almost *im*possible: traces of the weed remain no matter how hard
I scrub.

I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work? I'm always afraid that it might
do for other things as well as the blanket weed. The one that I did try
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.

I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly" :-(

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

I get Blanket weed in our pond every spring but by summer it's usually gone
unless I have to replace a significant amount of water with tap water.
The nitrogen in the tap water and from detritus in the pond (fish crap, dead
plants etc) gets "eaten" by the plants in the pond, mainly large waterlilies
which also help shade the water from the sun. I do try to keep the pond
clean too with a large swimming pool vac but that then introduces the
dreaded tap water with dissolved fertilizer.
A large biological filter running constantly helps too.
--
Regards
Bob Hobden
W.of London. UK
harry
2011-02-09 18:42:53 UTC
Permalink
Yes - a popular topic. :-(  I realise that this is a FAQ, but technology
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.
I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.
I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.  
It's almost *im*possible:  traces of the weed remain no matter how hard
I scrub.
I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work?  I'm always afraid that it might
do for other things as well as the blanket weed.  The one that I did try
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.
 I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly"  :-(
Cheers
John
The reason it thrives is nitrogen in the water. This comes from
rotting plant material, fish shit and sometimes runoff water going in
your pond. If you can run rainwater from the roof directly into your
pond (nothing dissolved in it) this helps by dilution.
If you have fish, there will always be nitrogen, the only way to
eliminate it is with a filter, bacterialogal filter and UV light
thingy. They sell the sort of stuff at koi shops. Now the koi thing is
passing you can pick them up fairly cheap, also 2nd hand.
harry
2011-02-09 18:50:19 UTC
Permalink
Post by harry
Yes - a popular topic. :-(  I realise that this is a FAQ, but technology
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.
I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.
I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.  
It's almost *im*possible:  traces of the weed remain no matter how hard
I scrub.
I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work?  I'm always afraid that it might
do for other things as well as the blanket weed.  The one that I did try
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.
 I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly"  :-(
Cheers
John
The reason it thrives is nitrogen in the water. This comes from
rotting plant material, fish shit and sometimes runoff water going in
your pond. If you can run rainwater from the roof directly into your
pond (nothing dissolved in it) this helps by dilution.
If you have fish, there will always be nitrogen, the only way to
eliminate it is with a filter, bacterialogal filter and UV light
thingy. They sell the sort of stuff at koi shops. Now the koi thing is
passing you can pick them up fairly cheap, also 2nd hand.- Hide quoted text -
- Show quoted text -
Growing plants, algae etc, will not eliminate the nitrogen, when it
dies it just recycles back into your pond. It is a closed sytem. The
only way to break it is by removing dead plant material, easier said
than done unless you MT the pond. And run a filter thing.
Flossie Lurker
2011-02-09 19:17:51 UTC
Permalink
Years ago this was destined to be the blanket weed FAQ but Cormaic left
before it was created:


Algae, which includes blanket weed, thrives on nutrients, sunlight and
carbon dioxide in pond water. This is why blanket weed topics always
crop up on urg at the start of summer. Sunlight levels increase, pond
water starts to turn green and blanket weed grows.

For starters -

Are you sure that nutrients (compost, growmore, miracle grow, dead
vegetation, plain old soil etc) are not being washed off your garden
and into the pond when it rains?

Are you sure you are not overfeeding your fish and that the extra food
is rotting to provide blanket weed food?

Is your pond is a new one? Don't keep filling it up with 'new' water to
try to clear it because if you do, you will just set yourself back to
square one every time as most tap water contains levels of Nitrate from
farmland runoff thus increasing your problem.
Take heart from the fact that it can take three or four years for
the water in a new wildlife type pond to stabilise into a well
balanced state.

Does the pond have a liner or is it a manmade 'natural' one ie a big
hole in clay ground? Nutrients may be more of a problem in a natural
pond than in a lined one - but don't quote me on that.

Blanket weed isn't killed by your pond filter.
Blanket weed will happily clog up your filter.
In fact, if your filter is a biological one, it will actually convert
toxic Ammonia waste from your fish into less toxic Nitrates again
increasing your weed problem.


To make the blanket weed disappear, find a way of reducing the
sunlight and nutrient levels in your pond and increasing the oxygen
level.

Our local pond expert says:
"Don't work against mother nature, try to work with her".

The most natural way to remove blanket weed, as it starts to grow in
early summer, is to encourage lots of tadpoles. Among other things,
they feed on blanket weed. However if you keep fish in your pond the
tadpoles will be a welcome food for them.



Here are some suggestions
=========================


Reducing sunlight
-----------------

Reducing the sunlight entering the pond is usually achieved by making
sure the surface is half covered with leaves of lilies or other
surface hugging plants such as frog bit and aponogeton.

Some urglers have even tried:
- Azolla (fairy moss) - fast growing and can be scooped off the
surface without harming the pond creatures.
- Covering the pond with a big sheet - can be placed over the pond
when sunlight at its brightest.


Reducing Nutrients
------------------

Reducing the nutrients is achieved by continually removing the blanket
weed. That is, as the blanket weed grows it absorbs nutrients
therefore the more you remove from the pond the more nutrients are
removed.

To catch your blanket weed, you can use a tuning fork shaped
stick and twirl the blanket weed round it. You can use a plain
straight stick if you want and use the same circular action as a
candy floss catcher.

Just be careful that no little pond creatures are caught in the
weed as you remove it. In fact, leave it at the side of the pond for
a couple of days so any that are caught can crawl back into the pond.

It has also been suggested that growing water cress has the same
effect. It grows quickly therefore absorbs nutrients so that the
more you remove, the more nutrients are removed. The same can be
said for any aquatic plant, but water cress seems to be the fastest
grower therefore the fastest nutrient absorber.
***Warning*** do not eat any watercress grown in a pond because it
could give you Liver Flukes.***


Increasing Oxygen
-----------------

Well, obviously, you chuck in some oxygenating water plants.
It is amazing to watch the streams of tiny bubbles rising from
these plants when the sun shines on them!


Some things other people have tried
===================================

Barley Straw
------------

Barley straw works very well it just takes a little time. It *has*
to be barley straw and not any other kind. I have used this method
for years successfully.
[OldMolly]

I also use barley straw. Research papers that I have read suggest that
the barley straw works best when it is placed in front of moving water
and hence giving the naturally released chemical, that I believe
prevents the weed growing rather than killing it off, an opportunity
of dispersing throughout the pond.
[AndyP]

The reason that the Barley Straw works is AFIAK it absorbs the excess
nitrogen in the pond that the algae feed on. Yes it must be organic,
or bought from an aquatic shop, as the chemicals sprayed on to it by
farmers will kill the wildlife in the pond. Growing it yourself is
one good answer, if you have the space.
[Mike]


Chemical Solutions
------------------

From what I remember of a chemical solution to our small pond years
and years ago, a chemical solution to your size of pond is going
to be expensive.
[Jane Ransom]

I cannot vouch for CLAROSAN as I have never heard of it. But with
respect to harming lilies & other plants most of the other chemical
remedies do. I would check what the manufacturer has to say about it
before use.
Chemical treatments can stunt growth/or even kill plants altogether,
but usually just prevent lilies flowering for 2-3 seasons and if you
think that is OK just remember when you stop treating the water, the
blanket weed WILL come back.
Remove the nitrates/light in your pond or get a couple of million
tadpoles ;-) Tadpoles are the best bet. They will chomp away & keep
it away until the plants have time to grow.
[Andy]

If you use chemicals to get rid of blanket weed, you must make sure
to get rid of the dead weed from the bottom of the pond, or it will
clog your pump and possibly affect the water even worse than the
weed did.
[June Hughes]

I once tried some that said it didn't harm plants, but at the
recommended dose, it most definitely did, and quite badly. And after
a few months the weed came back. Cant remember the make though.
[TumbleWeed]

Funny you should mention that, this year, despite it being sunny,
we have had little trouble with Blanket Weed which normally blocks
filters, pumps etc. Three things may have affected this:
The first is that we have let our Watercress grow rampant before
removing it (and the nutrients it fed on) to the compost heap.
The second is the use of "Pond Tonic Salt" at the recommended dose
(originally introduced because of a parasitic bloom which was affecting
our fish) and
The third is that we have not changed the water in our pond as much
as normal just increased the flow rate of our filters a touch to keep
the water sweet (it's a 3,000gal Koi pond so a lot of waste matter).
[Bob Hobden]

Yes there are chemical products which remove blanket weed but,
having killed off the b'weed, the weed decomposes and eats up what
oxygen is in the water. So, the usual recommendation is to remove as
much of the weed by hand, before one treats the water. Yes, this can
be a big job. I have seen boats being used to trawl the stuff up.
However, you asked what the products might be. One was called 'Algofin
Plus'. No doubt you can buy it in larger more economic quantities but,
250ml to treat 5,000 litres used to cost £5. - No cheap option !!!
Another product was called 'Algizin P'.
I found that patience (nature is a great healer) and adding no more
tap water seems to pay off.
Don't worry about the magnitude of the problem. Just think how
satisfying it will be when you succeed. ;-))
[ned]



But always bear in mind
=======================

The root causes of blanket weed are:

-> nutrients
-> sunlight
-> carbon dioxide

in the pond water.
Get rid of them and your blanket weed D I E S :)))
--
Flossie
kay
2011-02-09 19:54:58 UTC
Permalink
Post by Another John
Yes - a popular topic. :-( I realise that this is a FAQ, but technolog
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.
I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.
I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.
It's almost *im*possible: traces of the weed remain no matter how har
I scrub.
I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work? I'm always afraid that it migh
do for other things as well as the blanket weed. The one that I did tr
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.
I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly" :-(
I suppose the first thing to do is to work out why your pond has a hig
level of fertility which gives rise to blanket weed year after year. W
have had blanket weed in some years in one of our ponds, but with goo
plant cover and conscious attempts to reduce nutrient levels, it hasn'
been too much of a problem. Last year, for example, we had a smal
amount a few weeks into the season, which I removed, and once the wate
lily leaves had developed we had no more problem.

The three ponds round the north side of the house don't get it at all.

What is your pond like? In sun or shade? fish or wildlife? What sort o
plants


--
kay
Another John
2011-02-09 22:00:41 UTC
Permalink
OP here:

Thanks for all the *very* useful responses so far. (Notable that
nobody has recommended a "treatment" (i.e. from a bottle)!)

I think one of my main problems has been that there has been far too
much crud in the bottom of the pond for years, which may have provided a
nutrient factory.

We had fish for a while, but I gave them away when I realised they were
eating all the tadpoles and also all our snails. *However* I couldn't
catch one of the fish, and it stayed there for the last two years: I do
believe that that has had an adverse effect on the pond (which is quite
small - only about 3m by 1.5m by up-to-.75m deep). Unfortunately (for
it), the recent hard winter killed it, so that problem has gone away.

I've cleaned the pond, and I'm now filling it with water from the rain
butts. This new start, plus the advice received here, may help us
achieve a much better balance. I need a few more plants too, possibly:
the pond is in full sun.

Thanks a lot folks!

John
kay
2011-02-10 10:30:52 UTC
Permalink
Post by Another John
I've cleaned the pond, and I'm now filling it with water from the rain
butts. This new start, plus the advice received here, may help us
the pond is in full sun.
What I'd suggest, based on your further info, is:

1) don't change the water again, even if you do have more blooms of
blanket weed. Try to keep the same water year on year. Balance isn't an
instantaneous thing, it's something that develops.

2) try to cover at least a third of the water surface with leaves. Don't
cover all the surface, as this will mean the water stays too cold over
the summer and will affect your tadpoles.

3) you could try barley straw, which I've had no experience with

4) as well as the plants you are using to shade part of the surface,
grow something fast growing that will mop up nutrients, and pull it up
every now and again and put it on the compost heap (thus transferring
the nutrients out of the pond and hopefully on to your vegetables).
Watercress is a possibility, as is water forget-me-not. Don't pull them
up till towards the end of the summer - my newts use the water
forget-me-not for egg laying, folding the leaves around the egg.
--
kay
Another John
2011-02-10 17:52:33 UTC
Permalink
1) don't change the water again,...
2) try to cover at least a third of the water surface with leaves...
3) you could try barley straw, which I've had no experience with
4) as well as the plants you are using ...
Watercress is a possibility, as is water forget-me-not. ...
Brill - thanks Kay.

John
Bob Hobden
2011-02-10 18:32:46 UTC
Permalink
"Another John" wrote ...
1) don't change the water again,...
2) try to cover at least a third of the water surface with leaves...
3) you could try barley straw, which I've had no experience with
4) as well as the plants you are using ...
Watercress is a possibility, as is water forget-me-not. ...
Brill - thanks Kay.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Watercress is good for removing nutrients, as you remove the plants you
remove the fertilizer. Good for the compost heap too, don't even think about
eating it...liver flukes!
Water lilies are the best shade cover for a pond and the plants are big and
fast growing so they also remove nutrients. Get something as large as
possible for your pond, whilst N. Gladstoniana might be too big eventually,
N. Aurora would not do the job but you could get perhaps 3 smaller lilies.

http://www.lilieswatergardens.co.uk/

for some suggestions but remember the depth is the depth of the plant/ to
the top of the pot.
--
Regards
Bob Hobden
W.of London. UK
Charlie Pridham
2011-02-12 09:44:28 UTC
Permalink
Post by Another John
Yes - a popular topic. :-( I realise that this is a FAQ, but technology
changes year by year, and I'm wondering what the latest views are.
I'm currently cleaning out our pond, for various reasons, but one of
them is that I want to have a real go at the damned blanket weed that
invaded several years ago, and finally got the better of us a year or
two ago.
I have drained the pond, and I'm scrubbing at the liner with a hard
floor brush, in an attempt to remove as much of the weed as possible.
It's almost *im*possible: traces of the weed remain no matter how hard
I scrub.
I'm aware that many "treatments" exist (I tried one a couple of years
ago), but do any of them actually work? I'm always afraid that it might
do for other things as well as the blanket weed. The one that I did try
(Tetrapond Algofin) had little discernible effect.
I suspect that the consensus will be: "put up with it, and try to
remove it regularly" :-(
Cheers
John
John when you come to refill your pond can I suggest you try and pipe the
rain water from your house roof and do not use tap water, also avoid using
any high nutrient soils in any plantings. using rain water greatly reduces
the amount of blanket weed that can grow

Make some fake lily leaves out of dark green plastic sheet and float them on
the pond until the real ones grow enough (helps to cut down on the light)

Use lots of plants you should able to see 50% or less water in summer

Good luck
--
Charlie, Gardening in Cornwall
Holders of National Collections of Clematis viticella
and Lapageria rosea cvs
http://www.roselandhouse.co.uk
Another John
2011-02-13 16:06:34 UTC
Permalink
In article <***@mid.individual.net>,
"Charlie Pridham" <***@roselandhouse.co.uk> wrote:
...
Post by Charlie Pridham
John when you come to refill your pond can I suggest you try and pipe the
rain water from your house roof....
Yes, thanks Charlie. Don't worry: I've been an enthusiastic rainwater
collector since the drought of 1976 [when I was a toddler, natch. If
only.] With the aid of my mega-pump <http://tinyurl.com/6lm5jq> I've
re-filled the pond with the contents of three water butts [1]

I had iris sibirica in there, and also a water lily, both of which have
gone back in. I'll be adding water cress, as advised here.

What is *not* now in the pond, that was before, is half a ton of black
sludge, some of which dates back to previous ponds, and therefore 20-odd
years. Having always known that "sludge is good" (for small creatures,
natural organisms etc), I always encourage it. However I think I went
overboard, so I've cleared it *all* out, and will now allow a natural
build-up, which I'll keep on top of. [on top of which I will keep, to
paraphrase WS Churchill]

Other things which are no longer in there are (1) one ninja fish, which
eluded sight, never mind capture, for two years; the freeze did for it,
along with the fact that I accidentally allowed the whole pond to
freeze over, too thick, for too long: the water turned toxic. (2) 13
frogs, who also fell victim to my carelessness (3) no doubt numerous
smaller creatures such as dragonfly nymphs.

Pond enthusiasts will be glad to note that I carefully sieved the whole
"half-ton" of black sludge, looking for creatures.[2] A smelly business.
I found 6 live frogs, and two dead ones (the other eleven had floated
to the top already). I found NO nymphs, to my surprise. They usually
wriggle furiously and give themselves away in the slime: no wriggling
this time.

Finally: the plan is to let the pond re-start itself naturally (I am
confident of many frogs appearing shortly, and the tadpoles will have a
much better chance this year, without that damned fish around), AND THEN
to keep on top of blanket weed and other pests, with the aid of all the
advice I've received here: thanks a lot folks.

John



[1] Hmmmm -- thinks -- that means my pond capacity is about 850 litres
-- never realised that before).

[2] Using a standard mesh garden sieve, into my plasterer's bath, which
has proved *invaluable* from time to time in the 20 years that I've had
it.
Charlie Pridham
2011-02-17 12:41:11 UTC
Permalink
Post by Another John
...
Post by Charlie Pridham
John when you come to refill your pond can I suggest you try and pipe the
rain water from your house roof....
Yes, thanks Charlie. Don't worry: I've been an enthusiastic rainwater
collector since the drought of 1976 [when I was a toddler, natch. If
only.] With the aid of my mega-pump <http://tinyurl.com/6lm5jq> I've
re-filled the pond with the contents of three water butts [1]
I had iris sibirica in there, and also a water lily, both of which have
gone back in. I'll be adding water cress, as advised here.
What is *not* now in the pond, that was before, is half a ton of black
sludge, some of which dates back to previous ponds, and therefore 20-odd
years. Having always known that "sludge is good" (for small creatures,
natural organisms etc), I always encourage it. However I think I went
overboard, so I've cleared it *all* out, and will now allow a natural
build-up, which I'll keep on top of. [on top of which I will keep, to
paraphrase WS Churchill]
Other things which are no longer in there are (1) one ninja fish, which
eluded sight, never mind capture, for two years; the freeze did for it,
along with the fact that I accidentally allowed the whole pond to
freeze over, too thick, for too long: the water turned toxic. (2) 13
frogs, who also fell victim to my carelessness (3) no doubt numerous
smaller creatures such as dragonfly nymphs.
Pond enthusiasts will be glad to note that I carefully sieved the whole
"half-ton" of black sludge, looking for creatures.[2] A smelly business.
I found 6 live frogs, and two dead ones (the other eleven had floated
to the top already). I found NO nymphs, to my surprise. They usually
wriggle furiously and give themselves away in the slime: no wriggling
this time.
Finally: the plan is to let the pond re-start itself naturally (I am
confident of many frogs appearing shortly, and the tadpoles will have a
much better chance this year, without that damned fish around), AND THEN
to keep on top of blanket weed and other pests, with the aid of all the
advice I've received here: thanks a lot folks.
John
Sounds like you may have cracked it this time, hope so, ponds are one of
my favourite bits of a garden.

If without fish you find you have a problem with mossies, consider
introducing sticklebacks, too small to eat many tadpoles but they will
polish off any mossie lava (you don't of couse get to see them!)
--
Charlie Pridham, Gardening in Cornwall
www.roselandhouse.co.uk
Holders of national collections of Clematis viticella cultivars and
Lapageria rosea
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